NASA Great Lakes

HPDE at Mid Ohio – Lap 2 for 2021

GHIT 0205: Our HPDE at Mid Ohio – Lap 2 for 2021 – With NASA Great Lakes

We went back to Mid Ohio for a second lap in 2021 with Vicki, Jennifer, and Bill attending the May NASA Great Lakes event. It started out as a wet track and at Mid Ohio and that is always especially entertaining. We raced a turbo 1999 Mazda Miata (NB), a 2019 Mazda Miata, and a 2004 BMW M3 (E46) all were on street tires and racing brake pads and fluid. We go over the event where Vicki and Jen were in the HPDE 2 run group and Bill was in the HPDE 3 group. It all started out innocently enough. Then the weather went from warm and sunny to ridiculously cold and wet for Saturday and gradually warm and sunny on Sunday. The event was fantastic as always and the goals going in were designed for success. How did we do? We shall discover together within this episode. Special thanks to all the NASA Great Lakes team and the staff at Mid Ohio for a great weekend.

In this episode of Dominating with Dawson, we go over a variety of methods that can be used to improve your preparation for a “new to you” track and help you learn the track ahead of time and maximize your driving comfort on your first laps.

Any Guesses?

You can subscribe to our podcast on the podcast provider of your choice, including the Apple podcast app, Google music, Amazon, and YouTube etc.

Also, if you could give our podcast a (5-star?) rating or even better, a podcast review, we would greatly appreciate it and it would help us to grow the passion and sport of high performance driving.

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A link to the episode is: https://tinyurl.com/2021MidOhioLap2

We hope you enjoy this episode!

PS Please don’t forget that if you are looking to add an Apex Pro to your driving telemetry system, don’t forget to use our discount code for all Apex Pro systems. You will receive a free Windshield Suction Cup Mount for the system, a savings of $40. Just enter the code “ghitlikesapex!” when you order. They are a great system and truly invaluable in safely increasing your speed on track and/or autocross etc. The recently released second generation systems and app increases the capability of the system greatly.

Best regards,

Vicki, Jennifer, Alan, and Bill

Hosts of the Garage Heroes In Training Podcast and Garage Heroes In Training racing team drivers

Highlights from this episode include:

1) We go into the details of the HPDE group 2 and compare it to the HPDE 1 and HPDE 3 groups. We also try to summarize the various drills that we did during the weekend.

2) Jennifer (and Vicki) have a difficult time prepping for a new track and since this was Jennifer’s first time at Mid Ohio, we worked our way through it, but we need to work on a better plan. Bill has ideas. Stay tuned.

3) Vicki tries to break a very bad habit that is really holding her back. She has a difficult time staying at full throttle until the brake zone, especially in high speed areas. There are some aspects of racing that require a great deal of commitment and even a bit of courage to work through. Her resolve to break through did lead to a quality 720 at the end of the big straight leading into China Beach.

4) How did Bill earn a steak dinner that somehow turned into Crack Barrel Meat Loaf.

GHIT 0205: Our HPDE at Mid Ohio – Lap 2 for 2021 – With NASA Great Lakes

Our First HPDE at Mid Ohio 2021

with NASA Great Lakes of 2021

GHIT Podcast #196: Our First HPDE at Mid Ohio 2021 with NASA Great Lakes – Vicki and Bill

Jennifer takes the lead for this episode as we discuss the recent HPDE at Mid Ohio with the NASA Great Lakes group that Bill and Vicki attended as an early Father’s Day gift. The weekend was a bit chilly and started off with two dry stints Saturday and ended with two very wet stints. Sunday was the reverse. We go into the event as a whole and also go into what transpires at Mid O when it gets wet. Mid Ohio is widely known as one of the lowest traction tracks in the US when it gets wet and it did not disappoint Vicki as her first time driving at Mid Ohio 2021. If all goes well, Jennifer will be joining Vicki and Bill at Mid Ohio in about a month.

On this episode’s Dominating with Dawson, we

go over passing and start with defining what dive bombing is and then get into a discussion of the preferred passing approaches, especially during HPDE’s and eventually in wheel to wheel racing. This includes a discussion of the point at which a pass is complete. We also talk about the approach when trying to pass in a lower horsepower/momentum car.

You can subscribe to our podcast on the podcast provider of your choice, including the Apple podcast app, Google music, Amazon, and YouTube etc.

Also, if you could give our podcast a (5-star?) rating or even better, a podcast review, we would greatly appreciate it and it would help us to grow the passion and sport of high performance driving.

For instance, leaving an Apple Podcast rating is very easy. If you go to your podcast library, under shows and click on the podcast you can leave a (5?) star rating and enter your review.

A link to the episode is:

https://tinyurl.com/VickiandBillatMidO

We hope you enjoy this episode!

PS Please don’t forget that if you are looking to add an Apex Pro to your driving telemetry system, don’t forget to use our discount code for all Apex Pro systems you will receive a free Windshield Suction Cup Mount for the system, a savings of $40. Just enter the code “ghitlikesapex!” when you order. We have two systems for our team and Bill is looking to add a third for this season, pending CFO approval from Vicki. They are a great system and truly invaluable in safely increasing your speed on track and/or autocross etc.

Best regards,

Vicki, Jennifer, Alan, and Bill

Hosts of the Garage Heroes In Training Podcast and Garage Heroes In Training racing team drivers

Highlights from this episode on Mid Ohio 2021 HPDE event include:

1) Last minute car changes end in Vicki and Bill sharing the Toyota 86 for this weekend’s event at Mid O.

2) This was Vicki’s first time at Mid Ohio and her first time driving the Toyota 86 on track. Bill prepared her for driving MidO in the rain, but it is really a hard thing to comprehend how different the traction level is from a dry track to the wet track, especially at MidO. How did Vicki do? What did she think of the track? What did she think of MidO when it’s wet? Where does it rank in her personal track top 5 or 10?

3) How did Vicki do? What did she think of the track? What did she think of MidO when it’s wet? Where does it rank in her personal top 5 or 10 tracks? Same for Bill.

4) Our earlier skid pad events helped when going around Mid Ohio, especially in the rain.

5) Vicki goes through her first weekend with NASA Great Lakes in HPDE 2. Bill was in the HPDE 3 run group for this weekend. There are several differences between the groups and we try to summarize the differences and how HPDE 1 builds into HPDE 2 and then into HPDE 3.

6) Bill and Vicki try to describe some of the drills that are run at the events. The drills really are great learning tools and tons of fun. Some of the drills were changed due to the lower grip of the rain stints. NASA Great Lakes remains our favorite HPDE group to really learn how to be a better driver and racer, increasing not only your speed but also your safety on track.

7) The three biggest differences that are key to how NASA Great Lakes HPDE program works so well include the in class sessions, the track drills, and the way that the post stint debriefs are held and used to help the drivers to learn more quickly.

8) Bill makes several attempts to get Jennifer to go to the next event at Mid Ohio. While each was weak, they added up to the desired end result, lol.

9) Vicki is tired from the trip and switches the terms “Spoiler” and “Splitter”. She really needs to get more sleep before podcasting, lol. Luckily Bill caught it, but ended up doing it poorly and started the process of ending up sleeping in the tub again. lol.

10) We have noticed that the more Vicki learns about working on the cars, the more she worries that something is wrong with the car and comes in to check. Now we need to work on finding the balance. Still “In Training”, lol.

11) Our telemetry for this event consisted on the Apex Pro and the Garmin Catalyst. Vicki is relaxing in the car and starting to really understand and use the devices to help her. This was also her first time using the Garmin Catalyst on track. We are starting to develop a process to use both, both on during and after a stint. Vicki especially likes the Garmin since it doesn’t sound like Bill when she is driving.

12) A listener requested a discussion of Mid Ohio in the rain. We tried our best to summarize but it really is something that needs to be experienced. Bill also goes into how he approaches a wet track and how he approaches exploring the track to look for higher traction areas of the track.

13) Bill makes another feeble attempt to get Joey to come on the podcast. Someday he will weaken and say yes.

14) How does it feel to have a personal best during the weekend? Great. Except when it is a 1:50.01. Luckily Bill had one more stint to go out at the end of Sunday and break that personal best as well.

15) We go into the customary Good, Bad, and the Ugly, as well as what we learned during the weekend.

16) Vick says that Bill is right. Time to play the lottery. We might actually be on our way to the deserted island race track.

GHIT 0196: Our First HPDE at Mid Ohio with NASA Great Lakes

GHIT 0143: Using Video Coaching with Dion von Moltke from Racers360

Bill in the 2017 Toyota 86 — **Dion reviews Bill’s driving at the Autobahn Country Club in the 2017 Toyota 86**

Our latest Podcast, episode GHIT 0143: Using Video Coaching with Dion von Moltke from Racers360 is out on all podcast services

After a recent HPDE event with NASA Great Lakes at the Autobahn Country Club near Chicago, Bill sent in some video of a representative lap to Racers360 to try their video coaching and see what he could work on to improve. Dion von Moltke, from Racers360 and a podcast guest from episode #92, evaluated one of Billâs laps and who knew, it wasn’t all that bad. We thought it would be a great discussion of the use of video and the added benefit of having a professional driver and coach review the video for you. Bill learned a great deal and every driver will. This is especially valuable to the two ends of the learning curve. The newer drivers will start off breaking any bad habits and the higher level drivers will finally have someone qualified, capable, and available who could help them refine the last few items to help shave the final few tenths to get closer to their potential. The cost (~$100) makes this an exceptional value to all drivers looking to improve. Ben and friends discuss the concept of weight transfer during the Dominating with Dawson segment. Whether conscious or subconscious, it is an underlying fundamental to high performance driving and managing this is key to getting the most you can out of a car and reducing lap times.

You can email Dion directly at [email protected]

And follow him on Instagram at or twitter @Dionvmr

We hope you enjoy this episode!

Best regards,

Vicki, Jennifer, Alan, and Bill

Hosts of the Garage Heroes In Training Podcast and

Garage Heroes In Training racing team drivers

Highlights from this episode include:

The raw lap video a bit after 11:30 in: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Am-epQIjT4&t=758s

A 5-minute snippet of Dionâs review of Billâs lap can be seen at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iT2-NzD3o4Y

Eric Meyer from NASA Great Lakes also discussed this lap from a data analysis perspective here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMtlsfwbSso

1) We review some of Dionâs racing accomplishments including his time as an IMSA driver, winning the 24 hours of Daytona and the 24 hours of Sebring twice and his current work with Racers360 that is aimed at all levels of amateur racing of cars, motorcycles, go karts, etc.

2) A discussion of NJMPâs Lightning track and its (obvious) nickname. Just look at the track map.

3) The advantages of personalized coaching and the feedback opportunities it opens up the coach and the driver.

4) Dion asks Bill to self-asses his driving strengths and weaknesses. This discussion was very short and very long, respectively.

5) The coaching consisted of not only the âwhatâ, but the âwhyâ as well as an estimate of the potential impact on lap times and safety that area involved.

6) A big discussion of Turn 9 and Turn 10 at Autobahn that applies to several other turn complexes that lead onto long straights where sometimes you sacrifice a turn and sometimes it is not the best choice. It appears that as in life, nothing is 100% all the time.

7) Turn 1 at Autobahn is a high speed right hand turn that Dion went into in general and also used as an example of how best to break down a turn (backwards) to determine what to do for a specific turn, especially if you are unfamiliar with the track or turn.

8) To the surprise of absolutely no one, we also discussed vision and the need to relax and look very âlongâ and âwideâ with good scanning practices.

9) Dion is a fan of trying to work on one or two things at a time and not overwhelming the driver while learning.

10) Bill gives a brief description of the Garmin Catalyst and how it worked for him at Autobahn during his first weekend with the unit.

11) Dion gets (unfairly) put on the spot with looking at Jenniferâs crash at the Charlotte Roval. He agreed that is looks like a catch done well and a recovery not quite quick enough. Dion also recalls a time where he was able to catch a similar incident and save the car (with a bit of luck). It can be found at about 40-45 seconds into the video at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPq5K1giAC8

12) Racers in training weight loss challenge is entered. Please let us know if you want to participate. Dion may even help despite not needing to lose any weight personally.

13) Bill looks to scoop up a few brownie points when the opportunity arises.

14) Some of the takeaways and how they apply to all laps and all tracks. Many are going to be incorporated into his practice session at the track and on the sim.

15) Bill vents his standard color matching issues. Still no traction received.

16) Track Addict may be worth some investigation and if your budget allows perhaps an AIM SmartyCam.

17) Bill drags Dion into his current level of overthinking the geometry of a turn.

18) Another vote for the Senna documentary. Maybe Vicki will finally watch it. It is really fantastic, even if you arenât a race driver.

19) Post credits discussion of Mid-Ohio, with and without the chicane before the keyhole, and some volleyball discussion.

GHIT 0143: Using Video Coaching with Dion von Moltke from Racers360

GHIT 0123: Bill Griffin NASA Racing Driver and Jennifer’s HPDE Instructor from GingerMan

Bill Griffin has worked his way up to through the HPDE ranks to where he is a racing driver as well as an instructor, actually Jennifer’s instructor from GingerMan a few weeks back.Â We talk with him about his history and progression from having zero experience in performance driving to where he competes regularly with NASA and Grid Life as well as instructing when he can.Â Bill grew up liking racing as many people who grew up near Indianapolis did and eventually began driving himself when his work and family life allowed, proving again that it is never too late to start to enjoy performance driving and even racing.Â He is a very relaxed and knowledgeable driver and Jennifer loved having him as an instructor.Â We cover how the NASA Great Lake GingerMan HPDE classes went without being able to have in car instruction and offer several options that may be ways to improve the teaching methods without right seat instruction as an option due to COVID 19.Â The event was awesome, but as with everything else, you can always improve, in everything.Â You can follow him on Instagram at Bill Griffin.

On one of our simplest episodes of Dominating with Dawson we review crabbing or cheating into a corner.

We hope you enjoy the episode!

Best regards,

Bill, Vicki, Jennifer, and Alan

Hosts of the Garage Heroes In Training podcast and team members in the GHiT Immature Endurance Racing Team

Highlights from the episode include:

1) We cover Bill’s progressions from newbie track driver and not terribly mechanical to a regular racing driver and instructor (who has been to the track 5 weeks straight and counting) (Very jealous)

2) What is a competition (or race) license, as well as several methods and paths towards getting one.

3) Bill seeks guidance to how to schedule a season of racing with the rest of our team. Perhaps an appointment for hearing testing is in order.

4) Bill also goes into a quick review of some of the exotic sports cars he gets to drive with Extreme Experience and their clients. This is especially useful if you are taller, like Bill who is 6′ 4″.

5) Bill (the other) also goes over the potential limits in size for a driver in a Mazda Miata MX-5. We have seen one with a cage that fits the owner that was 6′ 8″ and swallowed Bill up quite easily.

6) Bill even goes over why he chooses to remain instructing the HPDE 1 group of students.

7)Â We cover how the NASA Great Lake GingerMan HPDE classes went without being able to have in car instructional and offer several options that may be ways to improve the teaching methods without right seat instruction as an option due to COVID 19.Â The event was awesome, but as with everything else, you can always improve, in everything.

Bill Griffin with his pupils — **Post HPDE Team Photo**

8) Suggestions included 1) potentially using in car radios to communicate to the students, 2) lead follow groups of only two students, 3) only using partial lead follow (allowing students to assume lead position and instructor to follow), 4) perhaps grouping the instructors and cars to match performance, 5) using better/more universally defined hand signals, 6) more use of different cones for initial track learning, 7) perhaps adopting an unofficial “HPDE 1.5” level/group within the HPDE 1 population, 8) incorporating the use of in car video, 9) positioning instructors with notebooks around the track to view at significant turns or areas of the track to provide feedback to the classroom or debrief sessions, 10) potential pathways to getting increased options for right seat/in car instruction.

9) The tricks and differences in being an instructor in a lead follow environment versus being in the right seat and the potential for lead follow groups to become longer groups, which can make some of the instruction into a bad game of telephone.

10) Riding a bike vs walking the track during a track walk.

11) Several tips for new to track or high performance drivers.

12) Bill unprompted supports Bill with the prep required before coming to the track as well as using 2-3 max goals and a few comments for each track session, especially during an HPDE event. Now if we could only get the Wilson sisters to agree, lol.

13) How your first few HPDE events can feel like your brain is drinking from a fire hose and how to potentially reduce this effect (like following the ideas from #12 above)

14) Bill F. tries to sneak in a Good, The Bad, and the Ugly segment on how Jennifer did during here HPDE event. Bill G. is much too nice to comply, but we will keep trying.

15) How driving in a lead follow instruction environment make lengthening your vision particularly difficult.

16) Tips for everyone (and us) on their next HPDE event. Ours will be at Pitt Race in late July with NASA Great Lakes.

17) The importance of focusing on consistently hitting your track marks and letting the speed build naturally. Because it will.

18) How teaching and instructing has helped Bill’s racing and how Racing has helped him as an instructor. Hopefully, it will help our Bill when he gets there, lol.

GHIT 0123: Bill Griffin NASA Racing Driver and Jennifer’s HPDE Instructor from GingerMan

GHIT 0122: NASA Great Lakes HPDE at GingerMan – Post HPDE Review

Jennifer, Vicki, and Bill check in to review how the recent HPDE at GingerMan went with NASA Great Lakes.Â We are not in our usual location and are recording under a roof in a KOA near Traverse City Michigan so there may be a bit more background noise than normal but we wanted to record while everything was still very fresh, even though we were all pretty exhausted.

Post HPDE — Giddy after the HPDE this weekend at GingerMan

On this week’s Dominating with Dawson, we go into a discussion to clarify apexes and Ben’s approach and how the point of rotation can apply to your driving, including a discussion of Ken Hill s podcast and how we should approach this during he (at that point) upcoming HPDE at GingerMan.

Jen coming into turn 2 at GingerMan — **Jen going into Turn 2**

We hope you enjoy the episode!

Best regards,

Bill, Vicki, Jennifer, and Alan

Hosts of the Garage Heroes In Training podcast and team members in the GHiT Immature Endurance Racing Team

Highlights from the episode include:

1) We compare the structure of this HPDE which focuses on drills and with the COVID 19 separation not allowing for in car instruction at this point.

2) The advantages and disadvantages of a lead follow, especially if it was a group of three this became more of an issue.

3) How quickly NASA Great Lakes is responding to the new rules and conditions on track in a rapidly evolving climate and imposed rules by each state and track.

4) What aspects of racing Vicki and Jen learned at this HPDE and what skills they refined during the weekend.

5) How HPDE track days allow for focusing on the correct and repeatable line vs our racing where we rarely use the line and handle traffic while driving both on and offline.

6) The drills we used during the weekend, including running the track in reverse.

7) How a great track walk with a very large group led to great discussion and options for approaching several sections of the track that even some national champion drivers learned more about racing options at GingerMan.

8) Ways to practice on your daily drive to help improve your track driving.

9) Apex everything!

10) The comparative differences between the HPDE 2 and HPDE 1

11) The skid pad – Winter driving event we had scheduled for earlier this year is again one of the negative highlights for our season

12) Vicki and Jen both had issue with getting their vision farther down the track, especially in the lead follow used during their HPDE 1 group.

13) Both Vicki and Jen both felt their speed progressively increased on the track throughout the weekend. It really was almost as if we needed a 1.5 level for these COVID impacted events.

14) In car video issues during the weekend impacted our results but we discuss what we think the video will show of our driving through the weekend. We shall see once we download our videos later this week.

15) There were some pretty spectacular cars at GingerMan this weekend and we could not help but pick a few of our favorites that came to mind in our racing hangover induced state.

16) Bill tries to work through Jennifer’s acceleration issues during the weekend and hos hypothesis is that she isn’t fully revving

17) Bill inserts his foot fully into his mouth. He will likely be sleeping in the bathtub for the rest of the week.

18) Vicki almost got arrested for stealing as one night by mistake.

19) Somehow, Vicki and Jennifer were introduced to the term Camber during our track walk for the first time. Not sure how we missed it up to this point but apparently we did.

20) We also went through our thoughts on the track and several of our favorite and more difficult turns for each of us.

21) Vicki’s favorite track of the weekend was NamregNig (GingerMan backwards)

22) Bill tries to get out of the hole he dug with John Pagel.

A few hopefully helpful suggestions for NASA we think are:

1) Groups of two students with each instructor max

2) Group cars and instructors by style, i.e. low HP cars with low HP instructor cars etc.

3) Perhaps a 1.5 level with less lead follow and more with the instructor in the position watching the student from behind.

GHIT 0122: NASA Great Lakes HPDE at GingerMan – Post HPDE Review

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